Chicago Jon V1: Addiction, Showmanship and Self-Discovery

DISCLAIMER: FEEL FREE and Jon Cerone do not condone the use of drugs and alcohol for recreational use and also believe that people are responsible for their own actions and should use at their own discretion. This episode may be triggering to those who have dealt with addiction or who are in recovery. If you struggle with mental health issues or addiction then please seek out professional help in order to help you through your struggles, just as Jon Cerone did with his. The episode talks about Jon's partying days and instances from his past that led him to recovering from addiction and getting sober. Him and his guest reflect on how these experiences made them who they are. Again, please listen to this episode at your own discretion. 

The echoes of Chicago Jon's past reverberate through the airwaves as I, Jon Cerone, team up with my friend Jacki to unravel the intricate tapestry of a life once entangled in substance use, now illuminated by the light of sobriety. 

We talk about Jon's run in with psychosis and addiction, and also his skills with flow art (gloving and poi) and rapping.

As the curtain falls on this introspective saga, gratitude takes center stage. The Chicago Jon persona may have evolved, but the spark of trying new things and the healing that comes through creative expression remain undiminished. We beckon you to join us on this continuing narrative, a tribute to the resilience of the human spirit and the unbreakable bond of friendship that has been our compass. Stay with us; more stories await as we carve out a space for growth and reinvention, keeping the heartbeat of Chicago ever-present.

There's a lot of love, reflection and forgiveness in this episode! 

We hope you enjoy it!

Stay up, and FEEL FREE!

Transcript

Jon: 0:00

Yo, yo, what's up. Welcome to Feel Free, the only podcast that'll tell you to chase your dreams and call you out on all your bullshit. I'm Jon Cerrone. I just wanted to give a little disclaimer at the start of this episode. It is different from a lot of the episodes that we have done previously.

Jon: 0:16

This is the first episode for a little series called Chicago Jon, which does talk about my past and my using days. I will be bringing friends on in order to talk about the things I had gone through. There will be the good and the bad side. I just wanted to leave this disclaimer at the start of the episode to let everybody know that in no way, shape or form are we telling people to go out and use drugs or alcohol. If you have a problem, please seek the professional help out, like I did in order to get sober. With that being said, if anything is triggering to you in recovery or addiction or mental health in general, you don't have to listen to this episode. Wanted to throw that out there for anybody who might be struggling with that. You still want to listen to the episode. It is a good one. Really enjoyed recording this episode actually.

Jon: 1:04

So without further ado, let's get into the episode. So I brought you on here because you were there for a lot of the partying that I was doing during the time where I was using. I had an alternate persona, nickname that was given to me at college called Chicago John, and because there were two, there were two Johns in our group at the time and people wanted to call us different things. That didn't mix us up, so my one friend was Papa John and then I am Chicago John, chicago John. So then there was also another persona that I had come up with too during my psychosis. That was called Evil, but we'll probably get into that a little bit later. Evil, evil, e-v-o-l. Love spelled backwards. How you doing so? When did we meet Jackie?

Jacki: 2:04

2012. We were trying to figure out exactly what month yeah, we were, but it was definitely 2012, very early into my husband and I starting to date Because you were obviously one of his best friends. Right and I was going to school at UIC. Right With also another one of your best friends, exactly.

Jon: 2:29

So the whole squad was actually at UIC in.

Jacki: 2:31

Chicago and I was actually in Michigan.

Jon: 2:32

I was yeah, I was in Michigan for a while, so the first half of my freshman year at Grand Valley I wasn't doing like any drugs, I didn't even smoke weed. I was still like a jock freshman year of college.

Jacki: 2:43

No, you're right, it actually was my junior year.

Jon: 2:45

Yeah, I'm remembering it now. Yeah, but then after the summer of 2012, which, like you know, our friends talk about, you know, the summer of 2012,. Which was ridiculous.

Jon: 2:53

2012 was the year 2012 was the year I was sober for one day in the summer of 2012. I remember it too. Everybody of 2012. I remember it too. Everybody had weird things to go do, like family events and stuff. I couldn't hang out with any of our friends and everyone was gone. And I'm just sitting at my parents' house and I'm like I don't have any weed or nothing. I'm like I guess I'm watching TV today. That's what I did. Every other day was filled with something, though.

Jacki: 3:19

You know we're not going to get through this either without talking about how great you were becoming at like gloving and like all the lights that everyone was throwing.

Jon: 3:28

I didn't even think about that too. You got to talk about the lights, right, the lights are so important that is actually part of the persona yeah so when, uh, people gave me the persona chicago john or the nickname chicago john, and it was at grand valley, it was the kid with the drugs and the kid with the gloves, you know because your talent show.

Jacki: 3:49

I'm sorry, I'm just jumping around. The talent show was a few years later yeah right, uh keep going.

Jon: 3:56

Uh, I still wish, like I was like gloving or spinning poi more. But you know that's what happens with hobbies that you let go of, but uh, muscle memory you just gotta pick it up again. Yeah, it was. I remember coming home freshman year of college and because grand grand valley ended way earlier than everyone else, we ended like almost a month before other colleges. It was crazy because we started early and we had less days off. So so like at the end of April I come home and the fuck are those fucking gloves? Man.

Jon: 4:31

Holy shit. I'm like can I try them? And that that sent me off. I was like this is probably the most exciting thing I've ever been. A part of, yeah, putting the gloves on for sure. A part of, yeah, putting the gloves on for sure.

Jacki: 4:47

and then everybody got into spinning poi and gloving and all these other forms of uh, we call it light art or flow art. Oh, yeah, yeah, some staff, some hoops, all kinds of whips and shit.

Jon: 4:55

It was nuts, yeah, um everyone loved the lights love the fucking lights and that became a huge part of my persona too, I believe in the summer of 2013,. Like I would just walk around with gloves on.

Jacki: 5:10

They were on. Even if you weren't wearing them, they were still on you at all times.

Jon: 5:14

Yeah, for sure.

Jacki: 5:15

Your pocket, your backpack, your car.

Jon: 5:16

Always had them Didn't matter. Yeah, they were somewhere, just in case you had to throw a light, show, you know, and to be honest, we would go to shows sometimes where they wouldn't even you know.

Jacki: 5:23

They're trying to like not promote drugs, so they don't want anyone bringing gloves, and you'd still find a way to get them in.

Jon: 5:28

I'm bringing those motherfuckers in.

Jacki: 5:30

What the hell everyone still had their lights, hell yeah they.

Jon: 5:35

They definitely started cracking down more in the later years, though oh yeah that's actually why you amazing lights went under yeah, things started, yeah, getting uh crazy.

Jacki: 5:44

They stopped letting you buy those drug test kits at places and they started making out all the see-through backpacks and stuff I mean, I get it, but at the same time, like they made the thing is they're gonna do drugs anyways, so they just made you not be responsible anymore, but that anyways. That's not what we're talking about right.

Jon: 6:01

Um, yeah, I, I was doing the gloves. I had this like Chicago John persona where I was like I want to be a rapper and I'm going to be a dancer and an entertainer and I'm going to be famous and stuff like that.

Jacki: 6:14

You still kind of have those things in you. That wasn't just like a drug thing. You're right, like you actually are very good at rapping.

Jon: 6:21

I appreciate that. I think you mentioned on an episode. You're like you gotta rap on an episode.

Jacki: 6:27

Yeah, this is not a John podcast until there's a rapping episode.

Jon: 6:31

I told you I rapped on somebody's podcast, though.

Jacki: 6:34

Yeah, but.

Jon: 6:35

You gotta do it on mine, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I'll come up with a way to play a beat through here and I'll rap for people. I'm going to come up with something, though. I will do it. I haven't lost those things, though the persona might have changed to Jon Serone, but it started with Chicago, jon.

Jacki: 6:51

There's each pieces of you, you know.

Jon: 6:53

For sure you know I would never. Once I got sober too, I almost felt like at the start of your recovery you almost feel ashamed of the things you've done, of course you know, and you kind of try and bury them, which is why I stopped gloving or like I've fallen away from EDM music. But, like later into my recovery, where I'm at now, it's like these are things to like be embraced, you know, especially, like you know, chicago, john. Of course my parents have like something to say about. Oh, I'm sure, yeah, you know that that side. But we're here to talk mostly about the good times, though, because I don't want to like, like I said on the episode with Edgar, like I don't talk shit about drugs or doing them on the podcast because I wouldn't be who I am without them. Did they cause a lot of pain and negative consequences? For sure, but if I'm going to hold regret over my actions and stuff, then I'm going to hold on to that pain and completely sidetracked from the episode. But I am trying to write a book on like forgiveness and stuff so that's

Jon: 8:06

awesome in in order to like not resent yourself and forgive yourself for those actions. You probably shouldn't regret them, right? So? Which is why I'm okay doing these chicago john episodes now, you know, because I still love to rap, still to dance, still love being a goof. You know, I had to let go of those things at the start of my recovery because they held not only the good memories but the bad ones as well. But now I'm able to embrace all the memories. I'll be on stage with my gloves one day. I know that for a fact.

Jacki: 8:42

I expect nothing less. For sure you always had the a fact.

Jon: 8:45

I expect nothing less For sure.

Jacki: 8:47

You always had the lights even after you've been sober.

Jon: 8:50

I know, yeah, there's just a time where, like the Chicago John phase, like I was gloving relentlessly.

Jacki: 8:56

Oh yeah, Obviously, it's like a big difference. Oh yeah, but I just think lights are always like a part of you.

Jon: 9:02

Right, I mean I got the light up sign.

Jacki: 9:03

That's what I'm saying.

Jon: 9:04

I'm pretty sure that's why they got me that too.

Jacki: 9:07

Of course, sober or not, lights are the best Lights are tight. Hell yeah.

Jon: 9:16

So I guess, where should we start with more concrete memories, because we were trying to jog each other's memories. Before there were a few apartments we would spend time at, you know, with a lot of our friends having really good times, what. I guess, where should we go with this? What do you think? Whatever you want? So because Electric Forest was 2014.

Jacki: 9:36

That was a big one. Oh yeah, there's for sure, but there's, I mean, are you trying to go in timeline? I mean, I guess it doesn't really matter, but well, we met in the fall of 2012.

Jon: 9:46

Yeah, right.

Jacki: 9:47

All of our Michigan memories are before Electric Forest. They are.

Jon: 9:51

Yeah, I still remember New Year's being really crazy because I'm going to be honest, like I came home for that winter break and I was tripping a lot that year.

Jon: 10:03

And I was tripping a lot that year and that was when I first put the gloves on, when I was at my parents' house and I like started like dancing and rapping to like a song and I was just like and I could see my reflection in the TV and I'm like I could totally fucking do this. And then for New Year's we were tripping real fucking hard and that's when I like I was like really getting into the whole standing up and gloving. That's when I like I was like really getting into the whole standing up and gloving because, like most people who give light shows will be like kneeling or like in your face and stuff, but I liked standing in front of everybody, like performing oh yeah, like in front of a room, yeah exactly, and I remember that new year's was when I I had first started doing that tripping the buns, tripping real hard I'm trying to remember which specific new year's you're talking about.

Jacki: 10:50

What did we do that? Day where were we?

Jon: 10:53

did we go to a show?

Jacki: 10:55

I remember, I think, our first new year's. No, I think we were at our friend's house. I've already seen right yeah, we didn't go to a show that night no, but everybody was there. Oh, you know what? Now it's coming back, so what happened? So, uh, yeah, we were at our friend's apartment in chicago on racine. I don't remember like the whole day, but I remember at night because we did like such minimal things, but we never slept. The night was, it was all night.

Jon: 11:26

You know, we never fucking slept like you know, if we sat on the couch, an hour had gone by before we had moved and it was crazy because there's almost like uh, now that I'm like thinking back to it, there was uh, like I'm I'd call it a micro environment, so the room was like broken up into little pieces of like people doing certain things. Oh, yeah. Like some people over here giving light shows.

Jacki: 11:52

Some people are in like room like private light shows.

Jon: 11:54

Some people are looking at like lights on the ceiling. Some people are given like a back massage.

Jacki: 12:01

Other people are just given a hug. Yeah, some are on like the balcony smoking, yeah right. Other people are just giving a hug yeah, some are on like the balcony smoking, yeah right.

Jon: 12:06

Other people are like rolling the next blunt, like it was crazy, you'd have like 10 or 12 people in there.

Jacki: 12:11

And he would like just keep flowing and transferring. You know, I might spend like we might spend like an hour on the couch together and then, like once one of us finally gets up, you're going to go. Whatever it is that you, the next room you find yourself in, you're gonna be in there for like an hour with somebody else, right?

Jon: 12:25

right and you just like kind of change around and stuff yeah, damn, that was fucking dope and we all worked really mundane, low-paying jobs, and then we stay up all night and we do it again the next day. So after like the end of 2012, the start of 2013, that's when things were getting a little shaky for me in terms of, like, my psychosis.

Jon: 12:50

And then I had also started dating my first real girlfriend at the time, and that was also when I had failed out of Grand Valley and I was going to Alexian Brothers, which is like a rehab facility, and that's kind of when I came up with the whole evil persona.

Jacki: 13:09

Was all those times in Michigan before then.

Jon: 13:12

No, that's after that's after oh yeah, Really. Yeah, that's way after. Yeah, Keep going. Yeah that's way after oh really, yeah, it was way after.

Jacki: 13:21

Just making sure we didn't skip anything.

Jon: 13:23

No, that's 2014.

Jon: 13:24

Wow, okay, yeah 2014, because I remember coming home for in March of 2013. I had to do medical leave because I had failed my classes. My parents put me in Alexian Brothers, which is funny. My dad started out the episode he goes. He was like super emotional. I know you haven't like listened to it yet. He's super emotional. He's choked up at the start of the episode he goes. Just yesterday I was dropping you off at Rosecrans and you said you're going to breathe fire down my throat. Yeah, that happens, but yeah, that's when I came up with the whole evil persona. March of 2023. No-transcript. After moving to Michigan after the summer had happened 2023.

Jon: 14:15

Sorry, 2013.

Jacki: 14:16

I was going to say what Then?

Jon: 14:19

2014 was the times you guys. 2014 and 15 was when you visited me in Michigan. Okay, 2013 mostly happened here, so I came up with this persona. It's funny, too, because you didn't grow up religious.

Jacki: 14:36

Nope, nope.

Jon: 14:37

Not at all Actually.

Jacki: 14:39

Like completely, like didn't even like bother to know much about it. Well, you didn't know. Yeah, you didn't know anything about it. I was not affected by it, right?

Jon: 14:47

You weren't brought up in it, you weren't taught it Like it. It almost, it almost was non-existent. Yeah, Chris had to tell you it and you're like I had no idea about this stuff.

Jacki: 14:57

Yeah, my parents were just all about being a good person and the commandments of just being a human being.

Jon: 15:03

Right.

Jacki: 15:07

Which was nothing religious, but that's it. I saw what religion did to everyone else and I just kind of Just did your own thing.

Jon: 15:12

I enjoyed my bubble Right right.

Jacki: 15:15

But yes, why then you guys opened me up for sure.

Jon: 15:17

I thought it was interesting, though, because, as I like took on this persona of like evil, I was like whacked out right, and I'm literally telling people that I'm like god and the devil at the same time, you know. And then everybody else was like kind of like what is this guy talking about? And you're almost like looking at it like it's theatrical. So you and you enjoyed that, didn't you?

Jacki: 15:39

well, it's not that I enjoyed it like, oh my god, you're going through something and I'm just entertained by it.

Jon: 15:44

Well, no, when I mean that I'm like, was it like I was obviously like there were bad parts about it well, right, I mean what was interesting to you though here.

Jacki: 15:55

Here's the thing. Okay, for ever since I've known you, you have a pure heart, like the purest of hearts.

Jon: 16:02

Appreciate that.

Jacki: 16:03

Yeah, and even in the darkest of times, like when you were calling yourself evil, it was love backwards. Like, even in your darkest of times, you still cared about being better and like love and you were just like trying to like find a part of you and so sure, like to be honest, like maybe you showed it, but I felt just as freaking crazy. You know what I'm saying. I think we all were like you know, and I think the biggest thing with me is like you were unapologetically you Like it, just like you are who you are. There was nothing hiding and it didn't matter how dark it got, you were still reaching for something more. So I'm not gonna lie, some of the stuff you did was funny. You know I'm, I, I'm one of your best friends. I have to laugh at you, um, but I saw where you were trying to go, so I knew the darkness was just something that you had to go through it was a phase.

Jacki: 17:03

Yeah, it was yeah that you were gonna find the other end, because that's all. That's all you ever thought about. You were way too hard on yourself. That was always my biggest thing.

Jon: 17:11

Like you are way too hard on yourself I know you like were so mad at yourself I know, and it beat me down for years, though too, and even at the start of my recovery and even before, like even after everything that happened in those years in 2013, when I had completely lost my marbles I was extremely hard on myself the whole time.

Jon: 17:34

I really appreciate you saying that, because I think the whole time when I had like that falling out, that Chicago, john and evil phase, I had fallen away from the faith or how my parents had brought me up and the government and a whole bunch of like institutions, I had completely shed it and got rid of it and I was just trying to figure out what true love was Not even like love for like your partner. I was literally trying to understand why the world doesn't love itself, why don't we love ourselves. But I did it in a very angry way.

Jacki: 18:17

Well, it's not that you did it in an angry way. We had a lot of anger in us because of things that we were trying to escape from. So that's the whole reason why we were trying to find that love, because we didn't want to be angry anymore, but unfortunately, I was definitely part of it.

Jon: 18:32

Right, right. It was the only way we knew how to express it. Fortunately, I was definitely part of it. Right right, it was the only way we knew how to express it, Because we were like these times that we were sharing doing drugs, and in the apartments we're all just sitting kumbaya circle. It was because the world around us was filled with so much evil and hate that we were just trying to love, you know, and we're trying to like separate ourselves from that, you know.

Jon: 18:54

Right, or just like find any type of moment that we could escape it, you know, and see what life's really about. Right.

Jacki: 19:02

And not hold on to those things.

Jon: 19:03

Right, and the whole evil persona was me trying to figure out a way that I didn't understand, like why certain religions didn't love everybody. I didn't understand why certain political parties hated the opposition and people go oh it's not hate, it's, it is hate. You know, I was just trying to figure out why all these lines were drawn in the sand. You know, like I wanted to. The whole like thing was like I was. I was coming up with all these crazy, weird formulas and shit and chris was talking. Chris always talks about like the fucking triangles and the shit like, and my other buddy who I'm gonna have on, uh, the podcast. Like my room at grand valley was like covered in pieces of paper and like you know, it's always sunny in philadelphia, right, you know the scene where charlie's at the post office with the cigarette and he's like pointing and shit. That was literally me at Grand Valley trying to just figure out a way to tell everybody that we can love each other.

Jacki: 20:05

Life could be more.

Jon: 20:06

Life could be more, and I didn't start fully realizing that until I had to learn to love myself.

Jacki: 20:13

Oh, for sure.

Jon: 20:15

I mean, I know your perspective on it's different and everybody like I'm in a position now where I'm never going to use again, just because of course I've. I've lived that path, I've gone down it, I've done what I've done, you know, and I feel like I've learned how to love my life without all that shit, you know.

Jon: 20:36

so this is why the chicago john uh, volume one is happening exactly this episode so I can, we can talk about this and hopefully people can understand it too, that you gotta go through some fucking shit if you're gonna learn how to love yourself.

Jacki: 20:51

Yeah, you know well, you gotta figure out why you don't first. You know gotta figure out why you don't that and then start reaching you know, trying to figure out how you can how you can.

Jon: 21:02

First you gotta realize why you don't I like that. So there was this evil persona. It came about and I had to go to um, I had to go to alexian brothers and the chic Chicago John kind of phased out and it was just evil then, like to the point where I didn't want people calling me John.

Jacki: 21:22

Yeah, it definitely took a turn.

Jon: 21:25

Yeah, it got weird.

Jacki: 21:29

Well, again, I never saw it as weird. I mean, like you know, I knew who you were before we got so deep into drugs that I knew it wasn't like you had just lost your mind. I mean, well, you know, you weren't like a weird guy you're right yeah again like everybody's weird when they're all fucked up but, either way. Um yeah, no, I didn't think you were weird. I just thought that you were definitely trying to investigate an area you had to see through.

Jon: 22:02

I don't like the way you worded that, like you were looking for something. Yeah, that was the whole point.

Jacki: 22:08

Yeah, yeah.

Jon: 22:09

And.

Jacki: 22:10

There was no stopping you, we just had to be patient.

Jon: 22:15

Just had to let it run its course, really.

Jacki: 22:16

Yeah, exactly.

Jon: 22:19

The rehab facility definitely didn't help me out with that, though I don't think so either.

Jacki: 22:25

I don't doubt that. No, no, no.

Jon: 22:30

But that was still dating my first girlfriend at the time and then, after I'd failed out of Grand Valley, we had moved back here for a little bit and we spent the summer or up until like June. We spent it here and we were going to different raves and stuff like that, and I was supposed to be getting sober. But it wasn't genuine. And this is the moment where I started being really hard on myself, because I genuinely wanted to be sober. I actually wanted to be sober when I started freshman year of college, when I started doing drugs. I remember that year and I had done like things like a few days in a row and I'm like, all right, well, we got to like cut this out.

Jon: 23:17

And there was like a monologue in my head too, and it's crazy because even at 18, I was like we're not going to like achieve our dreams unless we get sober, and I remember hearing that when I was 18. But it just took eight years for that to actualize, you know.

Jacki: 23:36

Well, I mean, like you, it was something you definitely always said and knew.

Jon: 23:38

It was just something you weren't ready for right, yeah, so during that summer of 2013, like I wasn't genuine about wanting to quit, I didn't see the point in it. I was having fun and there were yeah, I was kind of forced on you right too Right yeah.

Jacki: 23:53

It's not like you saw yourself having a problem. It was obviously parents and wanting to you know us to be better.

Jon: 24:01

Right? Well, in all honesty, I lost a lot of weight too, though.

Jacki: 24:06

Oh well, for sure yeah.

Jon: 24:07

Yeah, it was like 50 pounds gone.

Jacki: 24:11

Wow.

Jon: 24:11

Yeah, I went into Grand Valley 180. Wow, and I went into grand valley 180, wow, and I went into alexian brothers 130 see, when I met you, you were I was that john, yeah, you were skinny right, yeah, yeah I mean, but I wasn't like I wasn't big when I went to gb, I was just kind of like a bigger, built like jock okay, you know, but yeah, you were in all the sports and everything yeah, and then and then, when I like had got admitted, it was, you know, like I was sticks and bones at that point that summer.

Jon: 24:39

You know, it was very interesting because I was. I was convinced I was going to be a famous rapper. I was convinced, famous I was going to rap with the gloves on my hands.

Jacki: 24:50

Well, see again, that's something that I don't think is that crazy People are famous rappers. You were definitely convinced, though, that you were God and the devil at the same time, and that was where. I was like. That's not true, john. But I see why parts of you, you probably had that devil and God on your shoulders. I was like that's not true, John, but I see why parts of you, you probably had that devil and God on your shoulders. You know what I'm saying For sure.

Jacki: 25:13

And so sure I saw where you were going with that and I just saw how literal you were taking it.

Jon: 25:21

This is going too deep now.

Jacki: 25:23

Normally in sitcoms you see the little devil and the angel on the shoulders, and then there'd be the laugh track at the dark part there was no laugh track.

Jon: 25:32

no, no, no, no, but that, uh, I think I had that fall too. So I had worked here for the summer, uh, my girlfriend and I, and then we had moved back. Um, when I got fired from the family business which was hilarious and I had moved back up to Michigan, my mom and my aunts like drove up every few weeks to like buy groceries for me and stuff. Still like super grateful for that too Got a lot of love and support.

Jon: 26:05

Had a lot of love and support. I didn't. I didn't see that at the time, but I've definitely. I think I've said thank you to everyone who was there through that shit. Um, still never gave up the whole being an entertainer dream, although like doing the podcast and the book is.

Jacki: 26:21

I'm saying that that's a part of you that's who you are. That wasn't like drugs. That just made you I I think the drugs made you actually like realize that you can be like. You can dream things and be them. You know what I mean. It just like made you want to dream Like it made me want to dream. Yeah, I don't think you thinking you were going to be a professional rapper was crazy, because it's in you for sure. Like every, like I said, all this entertaining things are in you.

Jon: 26:47

Right, it's not the drugs that did it. Yeah, but I let society tell me that those dreams were bad, mostly because, like as you know, I come from like a pretty I'd say generic family in terms of like aunts and uncles, cousins, and stuff. It's like oh, go to school, to school, get a job start a family traditional orthodox stuff, right.

Jon: 27:10

When you say anything that's out of line with that, like the eyes get really big. You know, if you're like, oh, I want to be an artist or a rapper, you know people start looking at you like, well, you're gonna make enough money doing that and it's like I didn't want life to be all about making money exactly you know so the drugs did help me realize that I can dream big, you know.

Jacki: 27:34

Yeah, you start exploring, like all these talents. Anything you wanted to do, you tried, you know.

Jon: 27:40

Right, I don't look back on regretting any of that. Fuck, you shouldn't. No, fuck no. I wouldn't be writing raps and dancing with gloves on. I wouldn't be doing any of that shit. Yeah, you know, it doesn't mean that all these pieces are still here.

Jacki: 27:53

You just don't have the drugs anymore.

Jon: 27:55

Exactly, you don't need them right, you know, and it's crazy because I I I find that a lot like mental health. This is was a mental health podcast for a little bit. We've talked, talked about the importance of habits and hobbies too, and sometimes when I hear a lot about the mental health problems with like people our age or maybe a little older or something like you, ask people like, well, what are your hobbies? And people are like, oh, you know, watch TV, go on my phone and Lisa gives me shit because I have too many hobbies.

Jon: 28:28

It's almost like a revolver or like you know, the wheel that you spin. It's like which one am I going to do now? I get overwhelmed by how many hobbies I can do, you know. So now, like, looking back at that, it's like something definitely to be grateful.

Jacki: 28:41

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, I think you have to have those hobbies. I mean, what did everybody do with all these screens and everything you know?

Jon: 28:49

we just can't have to yeah it's.

Jacki: 28:51

It's you have to like explore these pieces of you. How else are you gonna know who you are if you're not willing to like put yourself out there and try new things?

Jacki: 28:58

right it's not even saying you have to do drugs, but just like you know, you, you do, you do guitar and you've tried rap. I mean you try rapping. I mean you practice rapping and you've written a book. And just like you never told yourself no, you never set any limits, and it's, quite honestly, always been inspirational for me because it just made me be like, oh fuck, yeah, let's do that.

Jon: 29:23

You're like. This man literally doesn't say no to anything.

Jacki: 29:26

I want to do that too.

Jon: 29:29

It's it's. It's exhausting sometimes, but for sure.

Jacki: 29:33

I love it though because, again, you're too hard on yourself, because you're like oh, I love all these hobbies, but I haven't done this one in so long and I got to do that. I got to do that. You also need to chill.

Jon: 29:44

You know I'm bad at that, bad at relaxing, yeah, but having the ability to not say no, no limits, like you just said. You're not telling people to go and do drugs. I'm not telling people to go and do drugs. If there's anything I could tell people out of everything I went through, it's that you shouldn't limit yourself. You should literally just try activities, things dreams, absolutely Like fuck it all. Shouldn't limit yourself. You should literally just try activities, things dreams, absolutely fuck it all. Just go and do it like otherwise, like one of the biggest regrets. If you ask people who are dying or older and they always regret like not like when they told themselves no right, they wish they did more, or they wish they went yourself out there.

Jacki: 30:26

I should have done this and said this Right.

Jon: 30:29

So why not fucking do it then? You know, I just had to, you know, figure out that there's a healthy way to do it. So right now, with my health nearing like the pinnacle that it is, I'm able to enjoy these hobbies wellness, positivity and stuff. But I do have to thank Chicago John for bringing me Chicago.

Jacki: 30:46

John was a shit ton of fun.

Jon: 30:50

I actually had somebody last year who wasn't around for the Chicago John phase. He was on the podcast and he goes. Man, I wish I was like there when you were doing that because I bet you were a lot of fun and I'm like I you know.

Jon: 31:05

I was oh yeah I think I was, at least when I did come home that fall of 2013 after you know, uh, my girlfriend and I broke up and I had moved back here. The chicago john persona ended there because my tenor in michigan had kind of ended there in 2013, um, and I had gotten through the evil phase too. So I was like, okay, it's probably just John now you know yeah it balanced out.

Jacki: 31:33

I did, However the devil and got on your shoulders again.

Jon: 31:36

Yeah, and I'm like all right, they're there, but I'm John you know, and. I in the fall. I remember it Cause I do still keep a lot of my writings from 10 years ago, and I had written down like that's gold. I have kept everything. That's gold. There was something I had written before I had moved and left the place with my ex and I had kind of compiled like all of my poetry at the time into like a 60-page book. I was going to get published or something.

Jon: 32:06

But, I never got around to it. It was like called the Rise going to get published or something, but I never got around to it. It was like called the rise and fall of evil or something, and at the end of it I had written something that had said like, like evil and John Cerrone have been battling it out and now only John Cerrone is left.

Jacki: 32:22

I think I actually have one of your evil poems. I don't know if it's that exact one or not, but I have something.

Jon: 32:28

Really.

Jacki: 32:28

Oh, I have something from that.

Jon: 32:29

I kind of want to see it. Can you find it? It's in my email.

Jacki: 32:32

yeah, it's in your email Because I was going through all my starred emails. I'm crazy, okay. And. I was deleting really old things and going through like what do I still need? Because I've had this email since I was a child and, yeah, I saw I have like three poems in here. No, shit three writings or something. I don't know how long it's gonna. I mean, we can keep talking. I can try and look if you want, or save it, I don't know. Would you want me to look?

Jon: 33:02

how long you think I'm. Yeah, I mean you look, fuck it, find it shit keep talking um you know what.

Jon: 33:08

Maybe I can actually do a search yeah, but I had come home that fall and, uh, kind of gotten rid of those partying personas, but you know, the the drug doing dancing gloving rapper still lived on even when I moved back here. Um, and then we had the times that you would come and visit uh me when I was in Michigan in 2014 and 2015. Well, there was one other thing that you had mentioned, and it was a. It was a talent show, right, yeah, so I had got readmitted back into Grand Valley. After getting sober for the first time, I got my grades up, got readmitted, went back to GV that year in 2015. 2016 was the talent show, though, and it was in the fall, and I had choreographed a dance with my gloves and my shoes, and I did it to the Odessa song. Say my Name.

Jacki: 34:01

At school.

Jon: 34:02

At school.

Jacki: 34:03

In front of everyone Sober, sober, yeah At school. In front of everyone Sober, sober.

Jon: 34:05

Yeah, sober in front of like that the auditorium was packed.

Jon: 34:09

It was like two or three hundred people. It was crazy and they turned the lights off. They turned the lights off for me and I was so happy because I was like worried. I'm like I had asked him to turn the lights off. I didn't know Like this anything for three whole days leading up to it, because I was all worried. I'm like, oh what if they only turn off some of the lights? You know that my lights aren't going to be bright. I can't smoke right now. I got to practice the dance like I was freaking out and shit. It was weird because I like was walking through the common area, like on my way from a class or something, and this is what you said, probably like a half hour ago. You're like you always had your gloves on you and even when I wasn't like chicago, john, you know, but he'll, he'll never die.

Jacki: 34:56

He's still inside me and I always had my gloves on me.

Jon: 34:57

Oh yeah, long after you're sober, you still had your gloves on you and there was a sign as I'm walking through the common area and it's like talent show auditions. I'm like what the fuck is this all about, you know? And I had my gloves on me and I like walked in and I'm like you guys still doing like auditions? And they're like, oh, we're about to close up. I'm like all right, sick. Can I like dance? Like yeah, sure, and I like turn the lights off and dance to um a song it was a chrisley remix or something and they're like, yeah, you're in. Totally, that was dope, all right, because it was kids on the panel too and I was all excited. They're like, yeah, talent shows in like three weeks or something. I'm like, all right, cool. This is the first time I had like performed in front of people, like all the other times previously I had like performed like in a room full of, like you know, hippies and stoners and shit, which is fine.

Jon: 35:46

You know, performing in front of anybody is tough because you're expressing yourself and you're vulnerable. This was like. This was big, you know, and I fucking killed it. I think I did.

Jacki: 35:59

Oh yeah.

Jon: 35:59

Yeah, I didn't win, though, because there was some girl there who could sing like an absolute angel. She fucking won. Yeah, I was standing there.

Jacki: 36:07

Everyone went there with talents, everyone, yeah, no for sure, everyone there was extremely talented.

Jon: 36:12

It was great, but I think everyone was also there not even for the actual competition. Everyone was there just to perform because they wanted to.

Jacki: 36:20

Yeah, just have some fun, yeah.

Jon: 36:22

And yeah, as I fucking-.

Jacki: 36:24

It's not like you won anything, right I?

Jon: 36:26

won something internally.

Jacki: 36:28

Yeah, but like that's what I mean. It's not like there's like this big prize. Everyone went because they just wanted to like do something they loved, yeah. That they were good at.

Jon: 36:37

The competition was with myself. I'm like I want to be victorious over my own. How do I say it? Embarrassment, you know. Uh, embarrassment, you know.

Jacki: 36:51

I want to win this instance of me not being okay in front of a bunch of people. I well then, like we were like determined to show the world that, like you know, these things would be really cool yeah right.

Jon: 37:00

Well, like, because people like looked at the, the gloves and the lights rolled their eyes right, right, yeah. I didn't even think about that too, because, like when I went up there and the lights went off and like I think people in the auditorium were like what the fuck's going on? You know because no one like sees, shit like that.

Jon: 37:17

People were cheering the whole time, though, too, which was pretty neat, you know. I think my cousin's wife said I should like put something together for America's Got Talent, and I was like it's a lot of work, you know, but I think I'm just going to like try and pick it up as a hobby again, you know.

Jacki: 37:33

Yeah, why not?

Jon: 37:35

It's just finding the time as we get older. You know, that's the big thing.

Jacki: 37:39

You'll make time for the things you want to, though.

Jon: 37:42

Yeah, you're goddamn right For sure. So what else do we got? You know, we've talked a lot about that era actually in a good way, a bad way, a very wise way. Fuck. You think we got anything else.

Jacki: 38:03

I mean, I don't know, it's really just up to me. Do feel, yeah, do you feel like we've covered chicago, john, enough, uh, for we've said enough stories or perspectives.

Jon: 38:17

Yeah, I think I think we've done really good for the first volume yep yeah I really appreciate you being the first person to help me through this.

Jacki: 38:25

Thank you. I appreciate you having me be the first person here.

Jon: 38:29

Honestly, like I was wondering who was going to be the first and I asked you.

Jacki: 38:34

Thank you, I appreciate that.

Jon: 38:35

Well, you were there for it. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Jacki: 38:39

I'm always your biggest fan. Well, I'm your second biggest fan, lisa's your biggest fan. Yeah, that is biggest fan. I was your biggest fan, right, right right, lisa came in though yeah yeah, um, yeah.

Jon: 38:51

I really appreciate you helping me through this um and being my friend through all of it. Yeah always yeah, I really appreciate it. Um, I think we're gonna end here, though, so I hope everybody has enjoyed the episode. Uh, like follow and all that good stuff for more Chicago, john and feel free. Goodness, we'll be back in a few weeks, but you all know the drill Stay up and feel free.